Your Inner Child Knows the Way: Dancing with Creation and the Mystery

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Milena (00:57): So, hello everyone, and welcome to the Venusian Womb podcast. We are so excited to have you join us for this conversation. As you can see, we have a special guest joining us today. It is not just Meaghan and me, and we are so excited to bring this guest onto our podcast to really start prompting some conversations about whatever is coming through in this moment.

And I really just want to open up the field for everyone that's tuning in with us to take a deep breath, to land in this moment.

As we really allow ourselves to drop in and explore these threads of consciousness around specifically, we're going to be talking a little bit about the womb. What is the womb journey, this gestation process in creation? Talking a little bit about creation energy and where the yin yang masculine feminine polarity dynamics, how they tie into that process internally as well as externally to manifest these creations. And really just leaving a little room for flow for whatever is meant to come through us as we're exploring consciousness. And so I think to start us off, we would love Miles to

Give yourself a moment to introduce yourself to our community into the space.

Miles (02:30): Firstly, thank you for that great introduction. I got so excited about the topics of discussion and what we're going to learn here. My whole body started vibrating. So that was pretty cool. ⁓ Yeah, thank you for having me. And like I said, before we jumped on the recording, I'm both ⁓ honored and humbled to be the first guest on this podcast to be able to co-create energetically whatever is meant to come through and I use the word co-create very intentionally in that the configuration of the people present really determines and dictates the energy signature that comes through. In other words, if it wasn't me here and someone else, or if it was just one of you instead of two of you, the energy would be completely different. So this is a moment locked in in time where we are collectively downloading and going to have a very unique experience, one of one. And so very excited to see what plays out.

Milena (03:29): Thank you so much. I think just like bouncing off of that something that Meaghan and I will often use as a metaphor, is connecting to the thread of consciousness. And it's so beautiful how when you're, when you're in a field with other people that are also open and receptive, and there's almost this attunement of, of consciousness and of energy that happens within the conversation that kind of allows everyone within that field to connect to that same thread of consciousness. And then from there, it's, you know, you're saying something that's activating something in me, something in Meaghan, and it just kind of creates this symbiosis.

Meaghan (04:05): Mm-hmm.

Milena (04:10): And amplifying of everything that's present in this moment and within our awareness of our lived experience to this point. And to allow you also to introduce the fact that you just got back from Peru. So we are so grateful to also receive you after such an initiation as well.

Miles (04:32): Hmm. Yes, definitely just got back from Peru. This is true. lot of people have been asking me, do you need time to integrate? Do you need time to integrate? I've had some time for sure. A lot of the integration happens at the subtle levels and the subconscious and unconscious levels. So I know that the energy is moving and grooving. I've had ample time from my perspective to settle back in. And I love what you shared about the thread. As you were saying that what I saw very clearly and vividly.

Meaghan (04:47): Mm-hmm.

Miles (05:01): Was how the three of us make a very unique sewing machine. And in this moment, we're going to be weaving this thread on this tapestry, in this podcast, in a way that will be extremely unique. And everybody who tunes in to listen to this, whether they listen to part of it or the whole podcast, is going to experience the experience they're meant to experience with what comes through, through all of us, as we're going to record this.

Meaghan (05:25): Mm-hmm. And as you were both speaking, I just felt this like openness, this my body opening to the co-creation to the ooh, what are we going to what are we going to speak about? What are we going to co-create? And I do want to start us off with the question, Miles and ask you, if we were to ask you what does the womb mean when we say the word womb? What does this bring up for you personally?

Miles (05:49): Great question. What does the womb bring up for me in this moment in time today? ⁓ I see the womb as both an incubation chamber and a portal. A two-pronged energetic container. And when I think about gestation, I think about creation and really it being a conduit of creative energy entering from the realms of the unseen into the realm of the seen.

That's what comes up for me now in this moment.

Meaghan (06:23): I love how you said that too, in this moment right now. Like already there's this one piece that I was stuck on, I'm like that feels so right, because we're ever changing and new perceptions are always coming in and there's new parts of ourselves we're discovering. So I'm going to be taking that I'll give you creds on it. But I really love the way you positioned yourself and this is what's coming through for me in this moment in time. So yeah, thank you for sharing from there that space.

Miles (06:39): Yeah, thank you for that reflection.

Milena (06:50): I did also want to say there was something that you had mentioned in a previous conversation we had where you referred to the womb and this yin energy, feminine energy, which we will also go expand a little bit more on, but you explained it as an incubator. And I feel like there's this perception that, you know, has been spoken about a lot of the masculine, this yang being the container, and then the yin, feminine energy, being the actual creation.

And the perspective you shared was also seeing holding this yin energy as well as a container in its own right. And I'm so curious to dive a little bit deeper into that and exactly how does the feminine container, this incubator, how does that look like? And maybe how does that contrast more of that yang container that we are also setting up within the creative process?

Miles (07:51): That's definitely a powerful question. ⁓ What comes up for me in the moment is that in our society, we tend to very quickly separate things and label things to be able to grasp some type of understanding with our external environment to know how to be or not be how to interact or not interact. So, for example, when it comes to branching things into masculine and feminine, yin and yang,

One of the things that I feel that we miss and a really beautiful thing that we miss is that everything has two sides to it. And what I mean by that, and this is something I haven't really seen much talked about, even the feminine has a masculine and a feminine side. And even the masculine has a feminine and a masculine side. Everything breaks down like a dichotomy. So this can boggle the mind a little bit when we try to label something as one thing.

But when we flip the coin, we see there's always two sides to a coin in the realm of duality. And this is where the womb in particular is very unique. It's like the Swiss army knife of creation and incubation. It's a multifaceted and multi-dimensional energy. It's really an energy. Sure. It's expressed in the physical realm as a literal container of gestation for creation, but fundamentally it's a

Meaghan (08:52): Yeah.

Miles (09:17): For me, it represents an energy of unity, which is very unique in a realm of duality as well.

Meaghan (09:24): We lost Miles. There we go. Excellent. Welcome back.

Miles (09:29): No idea what happened. It's like you've been kicked out. But clearly this was destiny. Why? I have no idea.

Meaghan (09:36): Haha

Milena (09:38): I love that. mean, like, this is also we're just gonna we're just gonna keep go on to our next our next direction of this conversation. It cut there for a reason. So we're just gonna flow with it.

Miles (09:51): The energy

Meaghan (09:51): And it's still recording, right? Yeah, we're good.

Miles (09:53): Was too high. We were tapping into something that was beyond comprehension. And the internet gods were like, no bueno, we have to cut this. This is too powerful.

Milena (09:59): They're just like, kick him out.

Meaghan (10:02): Take them away!

Milena (10:03): No bueno. This is way too much sovereignty in one conversation kick out.

Miles (10:09): This is the only logical explanation.

Meaghan (10:13): Mm-hmm.

Milena (10:14): I agree. Oh, we're glad you're back. And I mean, if that ever if that does happen again, just we'll wait for you a log back in. I mean,

Meaghan (10:16): Mmm.

Miles (10:20): Good to be back.

Milena (10:27): Seems like everyone's connection is good, ⁓ my God. Jesus.

Meaghan (10:29): I think we're good.

Miles (10:32): Yeah. The forces are strong. 

Meaghan (10:36): Interference!

Miles (10:36): The forces are strong.

Meaghan (10:38): Interference! ⁓ inner child popped down. Interesting.

Milena (10:39): My inner child. My inner child just fell. Also look at how cute she is guys.

Miles (10:44): All right, it's time to go into the inner child.

Meaghan (10:47): Right? You know what, actually?

Milena (10:48): Talking about creation energy.

Meaghan (10:53): Would love to loop us back. We have some other questions, but we're back in the podcast. We got a little bit interrupted and now we're back. And as we were speaking, Milena's inner child just popped off her where she is. And Miles brought up a great point. We have actually personally been really struggling to record our inner child episode. So I think this is an invitation to bring you, Miles, into speaking. Yes, because this is very related to the womb.

To creating, to dreaming. And a big part that we've been noticing when it comes to dreaming and being with your room energy and your creation energy is the resistance that comes up. The resistance that comes up to dreaming and the things that people say, ooh, get your head out of the clouds, keep your feet on the ground.

That's delusional, that's not realistic. And the inner child kind of feeling like, but, I'm just innocently playing here and I just want to, want my dreams to come true and why is that too big? Why is that too much? And that's been a huge theme that we've been exploring and that's been surfacing in our shadows as we've been moving through our womb, getting to be acquainted with our womb space. So I'm curious to know Miles, what's from just what was said, I just said right now, and now that the inner child has just popped into literally quite literally popped into this discussion, what does the inner child?

For you, what is the inner child for you and how does this relate to anything that we've been talking about?

Miles (12:23): Well, the first thing that I want to share immediately that popped in right away is that we all come into this realm as geniuses and life intelligently for reasons known and unknown D geniuses us. And in doing so, we create a journey back to our inner child with adult eyes. And I really do believe that that is by design. To be able to cultivate one, a prefrontal cortex later on in life, and two, enough life experiences to make certain distinctions about how things are and how things are not in this realm, to then take those tools of adulthood and be equipped to bring them back to childhood to reconfigure and transmute the energy to blend the past of the inner child with the present moment of the adult.

To create the ultimate energy of creation, a revisiting of the inner child in later years, more refined.

Milena (13:33): Yes. Yes, what was coming through in that is just that we, as we mature, and as we go through life experience and evolve and develop ourselves within adulthood, although I still feel like a child, to be honest, there's so much more wisdom.

Meaghan (13:33): I like that. Feels like the spiral.

Miles (13:37): Mmm.

Milena (13:56): There's so much more awareness and perspective that we have of the world that we're living in. And it's like, when I do connect to my inner child from that time, like going back in time to little Milena, I did not understand truly at that time, what is the world that I was born into? And there wasn't that perception of, you know, what are the things that... I see in the world that I would like to actually change and bring change to. And it's kind of like the Mahatma Gandhi quote of, be the change that you wish to see in the world. And like you said, when we have the perspective and experience and exposure of adulthood, and we're able to reconnect to the wonder and innocence and the imagination and creativity of the inner child, we're able to nurture the creation with this refined perspective and vessel that we have as adults.

And it's just, it's very interesting, think, even meeting resistance in people when having these kinds of conversations, when dreaming or creating, especially when it's not giving you that... almost like that return, like you're not really getting that validation, things may not be manifesting yet, you're still very much in the creative process. And I think that's where a lot of people end up giving up. And so I do wonder if there's anything that you feel, you know, when you're really in the creative process, you're in it, you're giving it your energy, you're not really getting this energy manifested back in this three-dimensional physical realm. What would you tell your inner child in that moment?

Miles (15:38): It's a very interesting question. The first thing that came up for me beyond what I would tell my inner child is that one of the challenges we face as human beings with the creative process is that, paradoxically, we attach to expectations and the creative force that we summon as vessels goes far beyond any expectations or attachments that we could attempt to create or hold.

And it's in trying to own the energy of creation that we really stifle self and impose all these roadblocks on self because the truth is, and the fact of the matter is that we are not creating. We are the conduits of creation. We are the vessels that channel this energy from the realms of the unseen to the seen. But when we try to own that, that's a contraction. Ownership is a contraction. And this is where all of our problems stem from. So what I would say to my inner child. Is that welcome to being a human being, welcome to the creative process, and it's sticky, it's icky, it definitely will not go according to your plan, and this is where the expression comes from, man plans or woman plans, and God laughs.

Milena (16:57): Like, ⁓ my god.

Meaghan (16:59): Leggo and leggo!

Miles (17:00): Mm-hmm.

Meaghan (17:02): I love that because I also as you were saying that I was getting this vision of mirroring like parents that have their children and then try to mold them into little thems or mold them into what they expect them to be. And whatever you're birthing into this world, you kind of you it was part of your career. You let it into the world, you birthed it into the world and then you let it go. And then you don't have any attachments to that. And then you just support it and nourish it in whatever ways it's meant to unfold without trying to well, no, don't go that way. Let's go this way.

Dragging it in a whole other direction. So thank you. That was illuminating and I had a very somatic impression of it. was like, It felt very opening.

Miles (17:44): Hmm and something I would love to add to what you just said. I don't know if you guys are familiar with dr. Shefali She talks about conscious parenting and although I don't have children I remember watching a podcast many moons ago probably ten years ago and she said something that stuck with me forever and it ties into Creative energy in the creative process, which is your children come through you, but they're not yours We are the custodians of consciousness.

We are the vessels that essentially harbour this energy to be able to nurture it, but you cannot tame a free spirit. You can attempt to, and a lot of people, as you alluded to earlier with parents, trying to parent their children and mold them to match their expectations. In attempting to do so, you always find that there's some type of rebellion woven into there because you cannot control that which cannot be controlled.

Meaghan (18:40): Yeah. You said that I had two response one that was like, ooh, yes, and then my ego was that, but it's mine. The mind came in so strong, I felt it literally come through my heart and my throat. And I was like, no, Miles, that would be my child. I felt that. But I really I yeah.

Milena (18:56): Yeah. I also just, this whole idea of you are not the creator, you are the vessel for creation. This is a huge golden nugget and I almost want to highlight it because of the fact that it's our ego that wants to claim something is our own. And in that attachment to what it is that we're creating. This is where we're projecting all of these expectations. This is where a lot of the stories that create these emotions come up because we're attaching stories and projections to what we're creating. And this is also where there's also that control, like that desire to control how the creation is coming through. And like you said, this is really just causing our own contraction. causes that feeling that it can create feelings of disappointment of perceived failure. These are all parts of the creative process that we've spoken to as we've been in it. And it's very interesting, I think, especially when you're creating something that comes from this place of soul beyond yourself.

Beyond your own mind of this is mine. It's this is something greater than me that's expressing through me. And when you're creating from that place of soul, you're gonna have to befriend your ego because it's gonna be part of that process also. We cannot bypass it. And this is where I'm curious. I'm curious to see how can we in this process of creation, how can we begin to befriend our ego?

Especially when it's tantruming in these moments of, don't have control. It's how can we actually soften and become aware of it and allow it to be part of the creative process in a way where it's not interfering. And I'm very curious if there's anything that's coming through for any of you too.

I love Miles laughing over there already.

Meaghan (21:02): Listen, I'm already tantruming that my children can't be mine.

Miles (21:07): Well the good news...

Milena (21:07): I'm tantrumming that my business is not my baby.

Miles (21:12): The news about a tantrum is that after a tantrum, the calm comes. So no matter which way you slice and dice it, the good news is there's no such thing as an infinite tantrum. You eventually hit a threshold and you will find a calmness within the storm. So it's built in by design. That is you move through the energy of tantrum, you will find calmness. So that's good. ⁓ That's the first thing that pops up for me. The second thing, what you said about befriending the ego in the creative process. Wow. That is...

What comes up for me is that it's something that is done with great difficulty. In other words, I don't feel intuitively there is a hack to transcend the ego. However, an expression I love to use to describe a healthy relationship with the ego is what I call dancing with the devil, where you are moving symbiotically with the energy of your ego to allow for the creation process to take place. And what this means is no matter which way you slice and dice it, your ego is going to claim some type of ownership of your creation. Why? Because you're a human being. You're a being of two sides of the coin. It's impossible and inevitable. The key is not to fully identify with that. So to go back to one of your points you brought up earlier, we are both conduits and creators. If we identify exclusively with one,

Meaghan (22:20): Mm-hmm.

Miles (22:36): And we don't see both sides of the coin simultaneously, the polarity becomes imbalanced. So either I am the pure creator, look at me at what I'm doing, or I'm the pure vessel and I'm totally detached from this realm and things are flowing through me and I don't take any responsibility for my creations. So it's really a dance, an oscillatory dance between the two states of existence. And we will be met with resistance on both ends of the spectrum and a whole host of positive and negative emotions will pop up inevitably as we move through that space.

Meaghan (23:08): Thank you. Mm-hmm.

Milena (23:17): Balance. It is a beautiful balance between, like you said, creator, vessel for creation, the innate attachment that we have as humans because we care. Because we care. And it's and I think it's so beautiful to be human and to care so deeply for what is your soul expression and the ways that it's manifesting in the world.

Meaghan (23:18): Mm-hmm.

Milena (23:41): And then also being able to equally let go and let God or goddess and goddess to be part of it. And so it's a beautiful balance of both. And as I am continuing to be in this creative process, I'm realizing that it's always going to be a balance. It's always going to be this balancing of both polarities. And there's not one that's ever going to be more present than the other. They really both truly are.

And it's just, guess, holding more capacity, holding more capacity to be aware of both and to also choose which one is leading.

Meaghan (24:19): Mm-hmm.

Miles (24:19): Hmm. For sure. I think that what you highlighted there, what stood out for me is the importance of awareness as we're going through the process, because both sides of the coin are going to be present and it is very challenging to navigate those waters, but it is a teeter totter. Life is this teeter totter of attempting to balance and find harmony between the two polarities.

But it's interesting because human beings always gravitate towards some type of homeostatic point where there is pure and utter stability and certainty, but the fabric of reality is uncertainty. So when we crave certainty in a realm that's rooted in uncertainty, because most things are not known, then we have this inner tug of war where we're particularly hard on ourselves because we're trying to predict outcomes and figure things out.

Meaghan (24:59): So it's nice to be here.

Miles (25:15): And I really believe life is not meant to be figured out. That's a little bit of a trap. We think it can be figured out. Our ego thinks it can be figured out. So we go on this incredible journey of trying to figure it out. But at every door, we're like, oh, this is it. open the door and we open the door to another door and then another door. And it's this never ending maze where we cannot figure anything out. We think we understand one law of the universe. And the next thing you know, there's a new law. And it's not that the other law was wrong. It's just.

Meaghan (25:21): Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Miles (25:43): Russian dolls all the way down to the quantum and Russian dolls all the way up to the highest level of macro. And it just keeps going infinitely. The ever present and infinite mystery, both macrally and microly.

Meaghan (25:48): The way up to the cosmos. Mm. I love how you speak with visuals. It makes what you say so tangible that I could literally see as you're speaking what you're saying. Thank you. And for all the listeners that are listening, they're also very visual. It's so helpful. And it's interesting because as we've been talking about this polarity,

Yeah, what came up for me before, I'm kind of backtracking a bit. I don't remember what you said, Miles, but I know that when I started my awakening, I guess we could say, or coming into all of the spirituality, I was very clinging to like manifesting, willing what I wanted forth into the reality, trying to control it all. And, and kind of thinking like,

Milena (26:44): Same. You'll see us charge.

Miles (26:48): Me too.

Meaghan (26:49): I am God? Like I can control my reality. I just need to use my tarot cards and my crystals and meditate with the moon and all of those things. And who was that? A bit much? And then learning in the past year or two that there is this divine intelligence, which I do now claim to be God, which was very, very hard for me to do. I'm even getting red saying it out loud. Look at that and allowing it to be a dance, a dance with God, but also a dance with the devil because there's two half the polarity is always happening. And that is such a hard task. No, I don't want to say hard because I'm trying to like surrender this that things have to be hard. They don't have to be hard. They just are. And yeah, this polarity is so important to be talked about and that you to surrender to that co creation to surrender to not controlling every step of the way.

Miles (27:49): Mmm.

Meaghan (27:51): Yeah.

Miles (27:53): It's not an easy thing to process because it's essentially it's a paradox. We are doing and being done simultaneously. And the only difference between the two states is our perspective. We've all had to some degree an out of body experience. I know I have when I'm speaking where I clearly know that the words that are coming through me are not mine and I'm outside of my body and my lips are moving. And that's actually what's happening right now. And I'm wildly entertained by myself and by you guys, because I have no idea what's going to come through. So I'm able to witness myself as the conduit, but at the same time, we have to take responsibility for what comes through us. And yes, we are bridges between worlds, the world of the unseen and the world of the seen. And we get to have the amazing experience of being a creator and also being created simultaneously. This is the true magic.

Meaghan (28:35): Mm-hmm. Yeah. Wow, yeah.

Miles (28:50): Of this realm rooted in unity consciousness, and we miss it. We miss this magical experience of realizing we're oscillating between these two states of existence. And the only word I have to describe it again is pure magic.

Milena (29:06): So I do want to just highlight the fact that for us to really truly step into this space of creator, and I'm talking creator from soul, creator that comes from something that is greater than yourself. And what I found in my creative process with Meaghan and Venetian womb is that when we started this, we really connected on such a soul level that everything that came through us in the times that we were connecting and co-creating was not even coming from our mind. And we were also just, we'd go into ritual and then we'd sit down and start writing on a Google document and just like typing and being like, how do I even know this? Like, I don't even, I haven't even tapped into this archetype. Like I haven't even logically thought about this. We were just embodying it.

And having that kind of out of body experience is what you're talking about. And I feel like that was really one of those first times for me of really viscerally being so aware of it as it was happening. And I think for a lot of people, it could also be this flow state is what we talk about, you know, where we're just like, not even in our head, we're really just in the moment and what's being expressed. And I think for maybe some people that may have not yet experienced that or been aware that they're experiencing that process. Just speaking to the filters, like speaking to the filters of the mind and what is some resistance that comes up. And I find that I can also speak for Meaghan in this because we've integrated so much of this creative process is the perfectionist, the inner critic.

The parts of you that are like, just any of these shadowy parts of who do you think you are? Imposter syndrome. Yes. The imposter of... And I think that's a big one. That's a huge one, especially when we're talking about consciousness, especially when we're talking about the intangible realms, the great mystery of life, right? There is no certification for this. This is something that we learn as humans through experiencing...

Meaghan (30:57): The imposter.

Milena (31:20): Our humanity and also the divinity within our humanity. And so it's really something that we learn through life experience. And I'm very curious, ⁓ Miles, if any of these layers had come up for you in your journey of stepping into this soul expression and really just getting out of the way and allowing what is to be.

How has it been moving through those layers of self and really breaking these illusions that keep us in resistance and they keep us contracted from allowing this expression to even pour through?

Miles (31:55): Well, what's beautiful about your question is it brings up memories right away when I was in my entrepreneur days and I didn't formally give an introduction, but I'll give a brief kind of one-on-one right now to give people more context. So I built a private fitness studio in Montreal, Quebec, Canada between the years of 2012 and 2023. And it started just myself. I built it up to a pretty big business with a lot of people working for me.

And what I didn't know at the time was that that business was my womb, my incubation chamber of discovering all of these aspects of self, both the quote unquote good and the quote unquote bad and discovering who I thought I was in the presence of who I really am. And to be able to move through all the emotions, the highs and the lows, the perceived positive, the perceived negative of that whole soup of chaos in trying to birth something into this world with the predominant energy of what do I want? What do I want to create? And from that I-ness and from that egoness of trying to create something, life just humbled me over and over again to the highest degree.

Life literally had to beat me into a bloody pulp for me to quasi-wake up to what was really going on beneath my consciousness in both the subconscious and the deep unconscious. So waking up is hard to do, and it is a very arduous and heavy journey to be able to move through that energy. I'm glad it's done. I really feel like I paid my dues. That was a very long period in my life. And although there was success in what I did, the journey was, there's no other way to describe it other than chaos.

Milena (33:57): We're familiar with that.

Meaghan (33:59): I have memories popping up. I'm like,

Milena (34:04): Mm hmm. And it always comes it always comes in those moments of eyeness. This is mine. This is how I want it to look like this is what I want to create. And it's been again, it's humbling. That's exactly what it is. And there's no other word that I would say of realizing that. Yes, I am. I am consciously able to have autonomy in this present moment right now of this space-time continuum, but anything outside of this present moment, I have no control over. And also that there is no absolute safety. It's so interesting because I mean, in this work with, you know, regulating the nervous system, which I mean, Meaghan and I, we've been shifting nervous system regulation to nervous system attunement.

Because regulating means that you have to fix something. it's really just kind of this like, it's this changing, it's this shifting of state. It's not a fixing, it's almost just like a softening and opening. And I think just like in this process of expanding our capacity, a huge part of that expansion has been learning to surrender, learning to let go, learning to... learning non-attachment is a big one and it's a very humbling one. And I feel like this is just part of the creative process truly. And I think when you're in it, this is where you can really start to let those experiences shape you. Because like you said, right, they're all, all of these experiences are here. We're experiencing everything that we are exposed to in our life is to bring us into that path of alignment of this is

This is shifting you to become that iteration of yourself and to have that capacity in your mind and your nervous system to be able to hold what it is that is being asked of you. And it's so humbling to remove the eye and just, I am just allowing what is, whatever the is is and accepting the mystery of life and really truly letting yourself free fall into the unknown. And that's been a huge part of the womb journey for us is recognizing that the womb is so representative of the fullness, the infinite, the potential of everything that is and can be.

And recognizing that it is only when you allow yourself to be in the darkness of the womb, that fullness, this is where we can actually claim and connect to and align with what it is that we're creating and what's our next version forward. But you have to go into the darkness and into the unknown to connect to that timeline. And so this is a huge process. This is process of surrender, this process of becoming more comfortable within the unknown and recognizing that we cannot bypass it. It's impossible to bypass.

And it's going to bring up feelings of discomfort because we are human and this is learning a new way of being. And so I'm really curious if there's anything that comes up for either one of you about just this new way of being truly, because the person that I've had to become in this process, it's been an unlearning, relearning, unlearning, relearning to even get to this point, to bring this creation forward.

Meaghan (37:24): I feel like that really speaks to something Miles had just said before that within creation, there's also like this you're being recreated at the same time. Like there's there's something being translated and brought through you. But through that creation, there's also new versions of your civil either you're meeting resistance or your ego is trying to attach to something. And there's needing to let go or needing to re center into Okay, who do I have to become in order to allow this creation to

I mean, this is not exactly what you said, Miles. This is picking off of something you said before and now I'm making saying something different. I don't want to say that I'm putting words in your mouth, but you are being created into a different version of yourself to be able to allow the creation to come through you. And I think that's just the process of creation and unfolding and being human at the same time. So I don't know if that answers your question, Milena, but that's really what was coming through strong that I don't think there's no end point.

Especially, if we're coming back to like the womb is the fullness, but it's also where everything goes to die. So it's this continuous cycle of, I'm born, I'm death, I rebirth, I born, I die, I reborn and continuously learning new parts of yourself, remembering new parts. And I think that's also so beautiful that there is no end point and that there's always opportunity to, I don't want to say go deeper, but go deeper.

Milena (38:34): Learning and learning, yeah.

Miles (38:50): Hmm guys said so many beautiful things there ⁓ Yeah, lots of wisdom that was just shared there for those who have the ears to really hear what was said ⁓ Yeah, I what comes up for me, two things. What you said, ⁓ Milena, about the darkness and the darkness and dampness of the womb and where creation takes place. I think that's very important to highlight, particularly because everything that has yet to be created comes from the darkness, comes from the void. And we bring our light to illuminate possibilities that are expressed in a realm of probabilities to bring something from a state of frequency and vibration into a more coherent and crystallized state where we get to experience it in three dimensions. And in that darkness, that unknown is actually unlimited possibility. So the connotation usually attached to darkness is something that's scary or because it's uncertain, it's dangerous.

But from another angle, all possibility ⁓ is not known and it's within this void, within this darkness. And that is where the creation energy resides. And then we have to go into the valley of death with courage to be able to discover what it is that's waiting there for our soul, for our path, for our destiny. Because no two people are the same. No two people are on the same path.

Everybody has their own trajectory through the valley of death to discover the light that they are and that they need to bring to whatever it is they're meant to create and to be the conduit of.

Milena (40:47): It's so beautiful because I feel like what's the ways that this has been coming through for me personally is almost mothering my ego through my soul. It's really like because the ego knows the ego knows that it's eternal. It knows that it's infinite. It knows that it's so incredibly wise.

And it's just remembering. Like there is a soul remembering that we are experiencing in this process of being human. And you know, our ego, we're born in this world, we have a blank slate.

So our ego is like completely factory reset when we're born in this world. And so the ego doesn't have this awareness. The ego is really just trying to survive. There is a self preservation in that process. And so when you are in the void, and when we're talking about the void, it's even this transitional liminal state in life, you know, where you're just kind of like, I don't really know what's next.

Meaghan (41:34): Survive.

Milena (41:48): And experiencing some type of closure or ending or redirection. And it's the ego really that is the part of us that's freaking out, that's feeling the fear, that's feeling that survival, like it's gonna die. Like literally I've had moments of viscerally feeling like my survival is at risk. And this is kind of where... it's been this soul nurturance of just holding my ego and holding that fear and being able to speak words of affirmation and just this is where there is that relearning of like teaching my ego that this is part of how we get to that next beautiful place that we want to be that we desire because the ego is also what holds our personal desires, right?

So it is almost being able to develop a relationship with our ego from this place of soul that has this greater knowing. And what's been the most supportive I find in this process of creation and in stepping into the womb, connecting to the unknown, accepting the great mystery of life and that it will truly be a great mystery, regardless of how aware we may think we are, how much we may try to understand it or predict it. It's a mystery. And a big part of that, that light that's been so supportive for the ego is having faith.

And faith is something that has been coming through so strongly, is in recognizing that when you truly are stepping outside of, let's say, this matrix, this predictable way of being in the world and living in systems that are orchestrated to seemingly be predictable, right? Oftentimes, this is my own conditioning of if I get the nine to five, then I'll have the stability, then I'll be able to have the resources for all the things I want. To do and then realizing that's actually not my path, stepping into this world of entrepreneurship and realizing that everything is a risk. But then at the same time, recognizing that yes, everything in this path of entrepreneurship and creating trailblazing your own way, it is a risk, but also what seemed to be more safe or predictable is also just as risky.

So there is equal risk in both options. Although one has the illusion of seeming more predictable and seeming safer, everything in life is a risk. And I feel like that was a huge illusion that had to break to really be able to embrace the risk and have faith through it. And also trusting, there's a lot of self-trust that's built in this process of I'm going to continue taking steps forward even though I don't actually know where it's going to take me.

And it's going to require certain evolution and shifts in me and trusting that you're going to be able to step into that level of embodiment. And it's just, it's just kind of like this, this relearning of this new way of being and becoming familiar with the unknown, nurturing the ego through our soul and this greater awareness of this is all for something greater and having faith. And I'm so curious.

Miles, in your experience how your relationship with faith has looked like in this creative process and really allowing yourself to be in the void to step in the unknown of what's being called of you in this moment, especially having taken a complete shift from what you were doing in your past life and where you are right now and what you're creating in the world in this moment.

Miles (45:25): Well, what comes up for me when you ask the question, I remember a specific time in my business where there was a series of challenging events, one after the other. The bulldozer of the universe showed up aggressively and presently to clear the path. And I was operating before that with the belief that life happens for me. This beautiful, positive perspective. And then this showed up.

And there were so many things that happened that were not aligned with my preferences and desires. I had to daily convince myself that I wasn't a victim. I had to write on my dry erase board in my office. Life happens for me, not to me. And literally look at this every single day because my faith in my belief system about the construct of the universe was being tested. Now, unbeknownst to me at the time, I had to go on a journey of believing that life happened for me to then questioning does life really happen for me going into the victim energy to then reclaim later on a deeper conviction and faith that life happens not just for me but also through me as a vessel and a conduit.

So an important lesson I learned there is that faith is a dance and to cultivate more faith and conviction requires actually entering into the victim energy, descending into the catacombs and going through that and coming out with new awareness that going into the catacombs is just par for the course, that the dissension is necessary for the ascension and that we recycle constantly the energy behind our faith and conviction to really test it and to be able to cultivate it more deeply. So, by definition, faith is not something that's certain. It's a dance. It's a dance of believing that there's more than meets the eye in the future and clinging to that in some way, shape or form. And then trying to hold on to that. I'm almost seeing the visual of like a tornado, like wizard of Oz, like just coming through and holding on. And this is the only time when you really test your face. It's nice when you're on the beach sipping mojitos and you're like, I have a lot of faith.

Milena (47:40): Yes. Mm-hmm.

Miles (47:49): In reality, but it's when the storms of life come where you're really tested how real is your faith and how deep is your conviction.

Milena (47:58): Grace, grace, thank you for bringing in that perspective of it is a continuous coming back down into victimhood, meeting that part of self because that part of self is also your ego that's upset, there's like a non acceptance towards the outcome that is unfolded. And then also within that darkness and in exploring that victimhood, then refining even deeper. Your conviction in faith. And that is just the grace that is absolutely fundamental to the process of being human, while also allowing the divine to co-create with you.

Meaghan (48:43): There's also so much liberation that comes through in that process of the dissension into the catacombs to really test the faith, then to rise back up with like stronger conviction and sovereignty. And then there's almost like there's a part of me that obviously wouldn't want to do it again, but it's also like, okay, test me again. Let's see how deeper we can go in this conviction. Like what more, what other layers are here?

So yeah, I'm really, there's a big theme of like, there's this dance with life that's continuously happening in so many different ways. And you just got to flow with it. And like, where I've like, let the dance or the, let life be the leader and just follow, which I'm not good at, but. Or I'm working at being better.

Miles (49:24): Hmm. Yes.

Milena (49:25): Mm-hmm.

Miles (49:27): Yes, what you just said there about following that is very powerful. That is very powerful because there's not just a dance that's taking place. There is equally music that's in the background and there's the subtle music and then there's the music that we hear and there's these two dances that are going on simultaneously. And if we can tap in and tune into this music, we can start to move more harmoniously with the music of life. And the interesting thing about music, this is what's coming through for me right now. Somebody turns on some great music right now, your body starts to move and starts to dance without you even thinking. Is that you who's dancing or is the music making you move or is it both? And.

Meaghan (50:08): Mm-hmm. Mmm. Noooo

Miles (50:18): We all are dancing and being danced ⁓ always comes back to those those two sides of the coin. But what you said, Melena, about the victimhood, I think this energy is really important to highlight because the victim energy is a necessary part of the creative process. It's the permission for your ego to be upset that things aren't going its way or your way. And that's part of creation.

Meaghan (50:18): I like that. Yeah.

Miles (50:46): That things aren't going to fully align with your expectations, preferences, and desires. That's one of the paints that you have to paint with no matter which way you slice and dice it when you start trying to put the brush to the canvas.

Milena (51:00): There's no bypassing that process.

Meaghan (51:02): And it gives so much permission for tantrums. I love my tantrums. And I love now that I know like, there's like the, it's gonna be peaceful after which is why I do it so much. I didn't have the reasoning why I would tantrum so much but that makes so much sense because I know the peace will come. Just gotta let it out.

Miles (51:07): Absolutely. Tantrums. You know, when you said that just now, what I saw very clearly is the creative force moving through you so strongly that it is stirring up those aspects of self that don't align with the byproducts of the initial phase of the creation, because it's a trajectory and shaking yourself to a point where that energy is moving through you to get you to the other side where you need to be to fulfill the creative process. So you get stirred up. Thankfully that energy comes through to activate these parts of you that wouldn't otherwise be activated without that force moving through your body.

Meaghan (51:54): To be. I love when life shakes me up. It's a great feeling.

Milena (52:02): So I do have a question. Just continuing on with this metaphor of the dance, the dance with life, right? And there's this music, there's a subtle music and it's almost learning as individuals, we're learning how to flow, how to follow life and where it's guiding us. And then also within this dance, there is this subtle music. And this is also like the subtlety of our intuition and where that intuition, where that melody is leading us. And so,

Miles, very curious to hear a bit more about how you listen. How do you listen to the subtle music and where that's guiding you to? I would assume this would be through intuition, through endergnosis. How does that come through for you?

Miles (52:49): It's a great question. Well, the first thing I feel compelled to say is that at one time I was oblivious and numb to any music that was transpiring around me and in my presence, which led to a series of challenging events, which led to a quasi awakening, looking for order within chaos. And it was only at the juncture of attempting to find order within chaos that I began to start.

To hear some of the music. And so that was really a blessing. I really learned that going through chaos is necessary to shake oneself out of a hypnotic stupor to be able to become aware beyond the previous constraints to see what's really going on in the room. And in this vein, with the music that's always there, always playing, doesn't mean if we're not tapped into it that it's not there, but waking up into that.

So I went through that phase. Then once I started to hear the music, I went through this other phase, which I don't really hear getting talked about, but I feel it's so important to share, which is hearing the music and ignoring the music. This is such an important part of learning to dance with the music. It's like you hear the tango or the cha-cha and you're stepping on your partner's feet. Okay. This is part of the learning process where you're like, there's consequences when I don't pay attention to this music. The dance gets all messed up.

And people get hurt and things happen and you know, have to go through ⁓ cause and effect if this, then this. Okay, I didn't listen to the music. This happened. Then eventually that happens enough times in my case, probably a couple hundred of ignoring this music that eventually when you bang your head on the wall enough, ⁓ you take yourself out of that hypnosis and then you really wake up when your head is swollen and you're like, okay, I'm going to give a shot to following this music, AKA the inner guidance and the inner wisdom. And since that moment, there has been no going back for me. I live my life these days predominantly from the inner music. I'm going to use the Pareto principle percentage 80-20. I really, 80 % of my life try to live from that music, but it took me my whole life to get to a point where I could actually hear it, trust it, trust myself in the presence of it. And be able to follow it, to use that word follow from before, to see where it takes me, irrespective of what I want, and really hold the space and the energy for what creation wants with me.

Meaghan (55:35): Wow. Yeah, I feel like that was really beautiful.

Milena (55:40): Yeah, and that's exactly it. That's that's that's the whole part of being human. Really, this is a new way of being this is a new way of being where we're living not in a construct of reality that is predictable. And we're allowing to really live in the mystery. And within that, there's a lot of expansion of capacity of the nervous system to be able to hold this risk, this perceived risk, all of the unknown variables that are ultimately not within our control if they're outside of this present moment. And there is a lot of trust that's built in that trusting in the ways that, you know, that music is being translated in your mind of, this is actually what it's saying.

And also trusting yourself to listen and to take steps forward, even when your ego is like, I don't want to take a step forward that way. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I don't want to do this. Right. But also recognizing that's what life is asking you. there is a, that's when kind of life is moving through you is especially in those moments where we reach this threshold. And then from there, it's, either need to expand and evolve to move forward or not move forward. And then just kind of, this is where we're doing the looping, know, this is where we're doing that cycling of repeating similar patterns. 

And then eventually, okay, right. This is I need to take a step forward now. And so it's almost like are we choosing to move forward in our creative process and in creating our reality from a place of this is so hard and I'm so deeply in a state of suffering and discomfort.

And I'm tired of being in this state, or can we do this also from a place of empowerment and be able to have a bit more, a bit more ease and flow and surrender in the process. So it doesn't feel as chaotic is probably the best word. And, and I feel like within, within Venusian Boom, a big part of, of what we're really cultivating here is connecting to, we've been, there's a few names for it. We've been calling it the dream field.

It's also known as the quantum fields. We've also just been calling it the womb generally. So this portal for the unknown, for the fullness, the darkness, the mystery, and also all infinite potentiality that is outside of these constructs of space time. And then from there, when we tap into this field, this is where we're able to open ourselves up to a realm of infinite possibility and really within that space connecting to our soul to be our guide of resonance, right? Because I feel like a lot of guidance of the soul comes from there is this I either resonate or I don't, I don't know exactly why my mind can't comprehend what the resonance is or what I'm resonating with, but it's just an inner resonance and inner knowing.

And it's when we're able to really step into this field that we're able to dream beyond these limitations and these constructs of space time and what we think is possible. And so we've been we've been really playing with this idea of what it is to actually step into the dream field, to actually allow yourself to be open to the infinite possibility of life outside of space time. And we really wanted to also hold some space to hear about what is your personal dream.

And what is your collective dream? And maybe they're intertwined, maybe they're very separate, but really just honoring some time for you to share your dream on this podcast so that we could also weave this dream with you and feel like a big part of this new era that we're stepping into of humanity is nurturing each other's dream is how can we create this symbiosis where we are all co-creating with one another and in that co-creative act we're nurturing the dream collectively and individually. So yeah, I really just want to open up this dream field for you to dream with us.

Miles (59:49): Well, thank you for that. The word dream speaks to me very deeply. What I've kind of connected into is that this is a dream construct. It is a matrix of imagination that we are seemingly physically living in yet not. And the best way to describe where I'm at.

And this moment in time is to kind of delineate and demarcate the old version of me and this current version of me. I used to ask myself consciously or unconsciously, what do I want? And what has changed deeply and profoundly into this present moment in time is a part of me asks, what does God want? And by God, you can look at it in two ways, depending on your belief systems. God.

Guy observing doings up in the clouds, if that's what you believe and that's totally cool, or God, great oneness divine, infinite consciousness, the unified field, everything that has been is and will be. And I wake up every day and see what is required of me as a vessel in a conduit. And connect into those visions and downloads about what it is I need to physically do as a physical entity and a physical being in a physical realm to be able to fulfill this creative force and creative energy, which I believe is fundamentally what the fabric of source is that we live in a creative universe, a dream realm and a matrix of imagination. 

And just like that Russian doll analogy I gave before, I believe reality is a dream within a dream within a dream within a dream, infinitely in both directions, looping back around and connecting. What is reality? That's a great question. And one that I think we'll never answer. And intentionally so to not be able to answer that question, because as soon as the mystery is known, everything collapses. And I'll share a brief story about this before going into the deeper part of my dream. It's something that your listeners might be interested to hear.

Not shared as truth, but shared as something to approach with curiosity and to consider. My mom is a channeler. She learned to connect into an energy over 40 years ago. I'm connected into the same energy as her, but her expression of that is very different. She goes into a trans channel state where she leaves her body and a field of consciousness takes over her physical construct.

To be able to speak words using her to communicate whatever needs to be communicated in the presence of whoever is there for whatever reasons. And one day I asked this energy a little bit about, you know, where are you located? These typical human questions. What are you? Where are you located? How does this all work? And ⁓ although they explained that the construct of space doesn't exist, if they were to share where they were, to give our human mind some type of understanding within a hierarchy or order of space. They said we're on the doorstep, so to speak, of the prime source of all. And then they proceeded to say something that changed my life forever. And it doesn't mean that's true, but it affected me in a certain way. And I consider it all the time. So when I asked them, can you tell me about the prime source of all?

They said something to me that I'll never forget. They said, we don't know the prime source of all. And I found that a very powerful answer that in a field of consciousness on the doorstep of the prime source of all could not speak to what all was. And then it made me realize, we get to all have the unique experience of coming up with our own definition of what we think it is to anchor us with some type of guiding light for our journey of exploration and discovery on the trajectory of our destinies, but that there is a master mystery that's not meant to be solved that creates perpetual and infinite curiosity for us to pursue the dreams that are given to us that we get to then try to own as our own as we navigate the 3D realm.

Meaghan (1:04:24): Wow.

Milena (1:04:26): Mm-hmm the perpetual and infinite curiosity. That's exactly it because a curious mind is an open mind

Meaghan (1:04:34): Which then loops back to the inner child, because in that inner child energy there's the curiosity, the openness, the freedom to explore, the innocence.

Miles (1:04:45): There's a beautiful quote in the Bible and this has nothing to do with religion, but that's where it finds itself sandwiched between the two covers of this biblical text. And it says, unless ye become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. And that can be interpreted in a variety of different ways, but how it resonates with me at this moment in time is that unless we reconnect to the aspects of who we really are, rooted in this innocent and playful energy referred to as our inner child. We cannot fully and completely anchor ourselves in such a manner to be the true vessels and conduits of the creative energy that needs to flow through us that we so beautifully and elegantly see in children as they draw their pictures of the world and play on the playground with their imaginary friends.

There's great wisdom that's held within that construct of the inner child that at that age, when we're so young, does not have the responsibility and maturity to be able to physically channel to birth anything that is of a larger scale. A child can have a vision of a building, but they don't have the mechanics of architecture and engineering to be able to do that. And this is where the adult comes into play later in life. And that holy union between the inner child and the mature adult creates the ultimate creative force and everything you see around us is a byproduct of the inner child and the mature adult converging in some way, shape or form to truly create at a grander and larger scale.

Milena (1:06:30): Thank you so much for bringing that quote here. And I say that because this is something that Meaghan and I have been sitting with and contemplating is the idea that heaven, hell is a state of being. And it's accessible here in this moment and in this realm. And again, this isn't, this isn't, it's there is this like religious, I feel like perception and prejudice that may come up. But ultimately talking about heaven and hell, it's it's talking about, right, like it's it's this it's this darkness and this light and recognizing that.

There is, it is not just love and light in the world and we do live in a world of duality. And within that, it's recognizing that both darkness and light are present here and recognizing that it's accessible within ourselves and it's something that we access through our current state of being.

And within that, it's also being able to have capacity to hold both within self because there will be darkness that we are going to continuously cycle through, whether it's meeting our own darkness, whether it's being confronted with the darkness in the world, especially considering the time that we're living in right now. And I feel like it can be disheartening. There's a lot of fear. There's a lot of... disempowerment that can come up, I think, being human and also caring so deeply and being empathic and feeling deeply for the darkness in the world and how that's affecting people. And a big part of this creative process and this part of dreaming and envisioning a world that is greater than the world that we came into.

And it's beautiful to be able to speak to it, to be able to speak to both and to speak to the fact that both of these are accessible to us. And also what are we nurturing? What are we actively pouring our energy into and what state of being are we creating from? Because if we're focusing too much on one, if we're focusing too much on the light, then we're also not seeing the dark. But if we're focusing too much on the dark, then we don't have that capacity in that inner space to be able to create from the light.

So it's really holding, holding both and honouring both and acknowledging them both within self and in the world. And also then connecting to what is bringing your creation forward. And from what place you're choosing to dream, to dream of reality for yourself and collectively. And I feel like just kind of using that also to transition a little bit into your dream, your dream for the collective, your dream for the world and the work that you're doing.

Miles (1:09:23): Mm-hmm. Yeah, thank you for sharing what you just shared. ⁓ mean, there was so much in what you just said that I could speak to. ⁓ But I'll take your last question asking what my dream is. ⁓ So to kind of go full circle to what I was saying earlier, I used to ask, what do I want? Now I ask, what is wanted of me? And I've made the decision to follow that voice.

Milena (1:09:37): Mm-hmm.

Miles (1:09:58): For better or for worse, and irrespective of my personal preferences and desires. I would like to believe that what is being birthed through me heavily aligns with my preferences and desires. And so far that's been my experience of it. But I try not to take ownership of the energy that's moving around me, within me and through me. And my dream is to be able to let this energy use me in whatever way it needs to use me.

For facilitating environments for other people to cultivate their own light and connect more deeply into who they really are versus who they think they are so that they can be more anchored and grounded on their destiny paths to fulfill their creative energy that moves through them for whatever they need to create in their incarnation.

Milena (1:10:53): That's beautiful. Thank you so much. Yeah, and it's really, that's exactly it is, I always bring it back to this quote by Ram Dass is we're all walking each other home. And it's really

Meaghan (1:10:54): Mm-hmm.

Milena (1:11:06): We're all here to remind each other of our power and of our light and of our capacity to dream a new world for ourselves and for each other. And it's very beautiful to be able to embody this light more, to be able to illuminate more within each of us in this conversation, to be able to then express this light and hopefully illuminate that light and that awareness within anyone that's listening to this recording right now. And I really just want to honour, I really want to honour this ripple effect and the way that each of us embodying and stepping more into our light is also spreading that light. And the same way that this darkness and fear spreads.

It's also, it's counterpart love, love and compassion and hope is something that's also equally spreading. And so it's like, what are we choosing to bring to the world? What are we choosing to share with others? And it's really beautiful to be able to hold these kinds of conversations that are ultimately meant to spread more light.

And I do feel like that's where that hope really does live in my heart. And regardless of what happens, we don't actually know what the future is, but we can definitely move through life in this present moment with this hope that it will be something beautiful. And to continue to nurture each of our creative process and the way that... God is moving through each of us individually and trusting that that is for something greater and for something even more beautiful. And so I really do wanna harness and anchor this light and this hope in this conversation. And also just say thank you. Thank you so much, Miles, for sharing yourself and for bringing your energy and your light into this conversation.

I know that personally there was so many things that have been illuminated in my mind and in my heart from what we spoke about and what was said and definitely things that I'll ponder more on. But I do want to hand it off to you, Meaghan, if there's any final words or any reflections that you wish to share from our conversation.

Meaghan (1:13:23): I think I'm just sitting here integrating so much of it already. I'm like, remember, Miles said this and then Miles said this and this activated this in me. thank you for sharing your voice, your wisdom, your insight. There's I'm definitely going to be re listening to this episode in my own time just to come back and catch certain things that because I did find myself sometimes following the thread and then being stuck on something you said. And like, wait, wait, he's saying more goodness. I can't keep up. So but it was so.

Miles (1:13:31): Ha ha ha.

Milena (1:13:41): Multiple times.

Meaghan (1:13:52): Enlightening, there's definitely a spark of aliveness that there was many threads that I'm holding onto and we'll be bringing forth in to the way I'm choosing to show up. And I love the way your dream is to let the dream kind of move through you, just to let it what's meant to come through you every day. And I think that's such a beautiful, especially somatic way to just be moving through the world and honouring where you are moment to moment in your humanness and your spirituality and all of it.

So thank you. Thank you so much for being fully present here for the past hour and 17 minutes we've been together.

Miles (1:14:29): Hmm.

Milena (1:14:29): Yeah, and I do just want to say, Miles, if there's any any final words that you wish to share or anything that particularly stood out for you before we close off.

Miles (1:14:38): Well, firstly, thank you guys for having me. It was a pleasure to be able to co-create with you in this womb of the first episode of the podcast. And there's a very quick poem that I'll paraphrase to kind of close out that's coming up for me now, which is go something like this. What if when you slept, you dreamed? And what if when you were dreaming, you picked a strange and wild flower. And what if when you woke from the dream, you held that flower in your hands? What then?

And what this really signifies for me in this moment is that when we can put aspects of ourself that are in our way to sleep and allow ourselves to be consumed by the infinite possibility of the ultimate dream, we can bridge that which is from the worlds of the unseen into the world of the seen as this vessel in this conduit. Easier said than done. But I really believe that the word manifestation will eventually be replaced by the word dreaming. And that we are going into a collective consciousness of dreamers versus manifestors. Just some thoughts to share as we close out.

Milena (1:16:09): Yes, that is exactly, that is exactly the unlearning and relearning that we are, that we are holding here is recognizing that to hold, to hold this dream, whatever that dream looks like, it is a process. It is a co-creative process and it will ask for all of you, all of your presence. And so we're so grateful for everyone listening, for your presence in this moment, listening to this conversation. This is one of many more to come. And I, without a doubt, know that we will definitely cross paths with Miles at some point in the future and bring him back into some form of conversation about the womb or feminine masculine dynamics or whatever it is that is in the field in that moment.

But really just honouring this conversation and honouring your time and your wisdom and just the fields that we've co-created together and everything that's come through. And so, yeah, I really just wanna say thank you and for everyone that's listening on our podcast.

Again, we are so grateful for your time and honoured that you are spending your time here listening to this. And so just some, just a friendly invitation for anyone that does want to go and explore this a little bit deeper to be guided perhaps a bit more, a bit more outside of this conversation and this podcast more one-on-one is you're welcome to join our collective space. It is a space that is going to be open.

Basically for the rest of the year, we're going to keep this container for all of 2025. It's open, it's accessible for everyone. We'd love to have you in the space and really start to weave more of these dreams and to really open up more to this dream field and to this new way of being, to this infinite space of possibility and trusting that there is so much beauty that I'm sure will be born from this, especially when we are dreaming and co-creating because that is how we can have even greater impact and amplify this vision for the collective. So thank you so much for listening.

Meaghan (1:18:18): Come back next week.